God, Please Change My Spouse! What to Do When Your Marriage Expectations Don’t Match Reality

Steve Alessi:
No, you said makeup sex.

Mary Alessi:
I did not say makeup sex.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah, you did. So I'm just—

Mary Alessi:
Did I say makeup sex?

Steve Alessi:
Yes.

Mary Alessi:
I did not say it. They're telling you I did not say it.

Steve Alessi:
She said makeup sex. So wait a minute. You said sex. That's as far as it has to go.

Mary Alessi:
What is wrong with you?

Steve Alessi:
So I have no idea. Like I said, I haven't heard another thing you have said since you said sex. But since you're on the subject of sex and makeup sex—

Mary Alessi:
I didn't say makeup sex.

Steve Alessi:
I'm saying makeup sex.

Mary Alessi:
Why? It doesn't fit this conversation.

Steve Alessi:
Yes, it does. Because—

Mary Alessi:
Because we're about to have a fight.

Steve Alessi:
3. Hello and welcome to another episode of The Family Business with the Alessis. Today you're listening to Steve Alessi with his wonderful wife Mary Alessi, and we want to thank our audience because great viewership is taking place. Appreciate you sharing this. We're Actually coming up on 250 episodes of our podcast, Mary.

Mary Alessi:
We are. I can't believe it.

Steve Alessi:
Can you believe it?

Mary Alessi:
I cannot believe we've had that much to say.

Steve Alessi:
Guess what?

Mary Alessi:
What?

Steve Alessi:
Coming up on almost, we're getting there, 1 million views.

Mary Alessi:
It's crazy.

Steve Alessi:
On YouTube.

Mary Alessi:
Did you ever think this would happen? I mean, I hoped it would.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
That's amazing.

Steve Alessi:
I'm fully confident.

Mary Alessi:
I know you are.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah, I knew this was coming.

Mary Alessi:
Well, there's, you know, there's a lot of podcasts.

Steve Alessi:
Well, you got a lot to say. People want to hear you.

Mary Alessi:
And you too.

Steve Alessi:
All right.

Mary Alessi:
So it just proves that this is a topic people need to talk about.

Steve Alessi:
Very good.

Mary Alessi:
To hear what we have to say.

Steve Alessi:
Listen, if you like what you're hearing, it is still kind of like on the front side of 2026. There's a lot of people that may want to be building family rapport, and this could be a great opportunities for them. Why don't you just share this? Like when you are watching, and then subscribe, and then turn around. Yeah, great. We need comments. We love that. And then share with others. That would be great.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
All right, so our topic for today— oh Lord, yeah, I think you'll like this. And I only got a half a cup of coffee, but this is going to require a refill real soon. Yeah, because the title is, um, Say it.

Mary Alessi:
Just say it. Just say it. You want me to say it?

Steve Alessi:
Say it.

Mary Alessi:
God, please change my spouse.

Steve Alessi:
Wow. Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
Please, God.

Steve Alessi:
That's going to be heavy.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
Well, I will say it's— I don't know what you've done over the years, but it's evidently worked here because I've changed you. Somehow you've got me to dress like you.

Mary Alessi:
So let it be known that normally you're just like me. Today I saw your outfit and I went, oh, I like that. And I kind of went in and said, Yeah, I liked it. You inspired me, babe.

Steve Alessi:
Wow.

Mary Alessi:
You inspired me.

Steve Alessi:
And that's the change because I never really cared about my clothing, especially early on. It was like a necessary part of life and I didn't get the joy out of it. But you know, as you have gotten prettier and prettier over the years, I figured, honey, let me go ahead and I got to level up.

Mary Alessi:
Got to keep up.

Steve Alessi:
Got to keep up.

Mary Alessi:
Got to keep level up.

Steve Alessi:
All right, so is this even something we should be talking about? I mean, come on, you're supposed to love me forever just like I am. Isn't that how that works?

Mary Alessi:
Are we? Is that what we're supposed to do?

Steve Alessi:
Wait a minute.

Mary Alessi:
What?

Steve Alessi:
Who do you know who came up with this particular subject?

Mary Alessi:
And I don't want to know. I have a feeling it was an in-law.

Steve Alessi:
It was.

Mary Alessi:
Was it an in-law?

Steve Alessi:
Muña says, hey, this would be— what does that say about your daughter?

Mary Alessi:
God, please change my daughter.

Steve Alessi:
He's the one who came up with this subject, but we wouldn't let him tell it or share on it because she'd kill him.

Mary Alessi:
Well, now she's going to kill him because you just told everyone.

Steve Alessi:
Oh, Lord. Yeah. So, no, he was just someone you should even consider. I mean, for real, like, if you love me, shouldn't you just unconditional love? Shouldn't just love me the way I am?

Mary Alessi:
Well, that's the weird thing about marriage, though, because I met you, I fell in love with the way you were. And then we got married and the way you were made my skin crawl. Like, that has to change and that has to change. And oh, that is not going to stay like that. I can't. I won't put up with that.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
So what is it about us that we love the person in the dating process and even in engagement? Like, he makes me better. He makes me better. He's on my team. I'm a better person because of her. And then the minute we get married, we're like, you are a horrible person and you will change right now.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
What is that?

Steve Alessi:
I don't know.

Mary Alessi:
Living together, I guess.

Steve Alessi:
Well, I do think dating is just— it's a setup and it's not real. It's not real. I think dating is good for teenagers.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
It's, you know, you have a friend, you're not married. You're too young to get married.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
So just be a friend. And what do you do? You call it dating, you know, and now you're holding hands and everything and it's kind of cute. But I've noticed with our 4 adult kids that are now pretty much all married, and I was telling this to Chris the other day, it's kind of like the couch dance. Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
All right.

Steve Alessi:
So what happens is when they first start dating and they come over to the house, we have kind of oversized couches in our living room, and you can actually fit 2 people in one. Part of the couch.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah, one seat.

Steve Alessi:
One seat.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
Right. Because it's oversized. So what happens when they first start dating is they come and they sit down and both of them occupy one seat, nice and cozy and tight, you know, next to each other. And their hand is over on their knee or the thigh or they're got— he's got his arm around her and they're really, you know, super tight. And that's usually lasting, I don't know, a month. Maybe.

Mary Alessi:
Maybe 3 to 4. Maybe. I think it just depends.

Steve Alessi:
Oh my gosh. Okay, so then that gives way to— on our couch, we have the L-shaped couch. So what started real close in one part of the couch, now they have stretched over a little bit and they're like laying back where the L is. And now their foot may be rested on their other knee, you know, put their foot up and recline. But they're definitely not up close and personal. You notice this couch dance.

Mary Alessi:
Now a little, little space, please.

Steve Alessi:
They get a little space.

Mary Alessi:
You keep coming over. I need you to move over.

Steve Alessi:
And then give it another couple of months, and it's like now they have the armrest between them. Now they're divided on the couch, and they do occupy— they both occupy two individual big pieces of seats on the couch. And then give it marriage, and now only your daughter comes over. Or one sitting at the couch and one sitting on the table.

Mary Alessi:
It's true.

Steve Alessi:
And they just kind of wave each other and hardly talk to each other. It's the couch dance.

Mary Alessi:
It's true.

Steve Alessi:
Dating is so overrated, and it's not even, I don't know, realistic in the long run. So, yeah, you fall for each other when you're in the dating scene. You're just so overwhelmed with them. But then, you know, you do realize their feet stink, and then you do realize that they they don't always say things like you want them to say it. And now all of a sudden you're like, I wish they were different.

Mary Alessi:
I know. And it's not just— what I find funny is it's not only the things they say, it's just their presence. Sometimes, like, you go back to the couch and they're just sitting there, or they're not getting up and they're not contributing, or they're not doing what you think they should be doing. And you go, why aren't they getting up? Why are they still on their phone? Why haven't they offered to help me?

Steve Alessi:
Oh, gosh. At first couple of months, they weren't even on their phone.

Mary Alessi:
They were so into you.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
And now it's, what are you, just a lump of potatoes? Come on, let's go. And the expectations, I think, are the part that come in with marriage that you might not have in dating. Because I say this, and we said it in a podcast, God doesn't really bless the dating part of the relationship because it's not under a covenant. You could walk away at any time. And it does change. There is a battle that begins once you get married. And men change when they get married. Young men really do change.

Mary Alessi:
I've warned the girls, once the man pursues you and he gets you and you are his now, that ring's on the finger, he relaxes. He becomes something completely different. So be prepared for that. And I think you can tell your daughters that. But there's no way of really experiencing it until you go through it and you go, my mom told me all this.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
And it's true. They do change.

Steve Alessi:
And then when mom and dad argue, the younger adult kids look at the mom and dad, kind of tilt their head a little, thinking, oh, look at you. You guys got problems.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
Oh, my relationship's not going to be like that. I'm going to find the perfect person. We're not going to fight.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah. And every couple fights.

Steve Alessi:
And then they fight.

Mary Alessi:
And they fight at different seasons more intensely. And, you know, that I will say that one thing, even walking our adult kids through the marriage process, watching them go from the couch to not sitting on the couch to each other with next to each other to now they're married. And like, we can tell when it's tense between them, when the pressure's great or they've had a little tiff in the car. And now at our season of life, we think it's hilarious. Because we know you overcome those things. But when you're going through it in the first stages of your marriage, God, please change them is a real prayer that you pray. Not sure that you should pray it. But it is a legitimate prayer.

Mary Alessi:
God, make her different, make her more in tune with me, or make him less aggressive, or make him more attentive to my needs. And sometimes with girls, I can only speak to girls about women, is, and I remember we went through this, we want our husband to be our best friend right from the jump, almost like our sister girlfriend. And they're not designed to be that way. So when we want to open up our heart and share with what we're going through during the day, when we were dating, they wanted to know everything. Now that we're married, They don't want to know any of that. They just want to fix that. So what we hear is, you're not— I'm not heard. I can't share what I want to share with you.

Mary Alessi:
You're always shutting me down. I need to be able to go to you. You're my soulmate. You should have everything I need in this moment to just not fix my problems, but just listen to me like my sister would or my best friend would. And we don't quite understand that that's not how a man's wired. And we have to learn. So in that process, we start believing if we pray this prayer, God, change them, that somehow they'll turn more feminine and be more like a girl, and they're not going to do that. As a matter of fact, I think the more you try to pray that prayer, the worse it gets, because they're not equipped to change like that.

Steve Alessi:
Right.

Mary Alessi:
And there is a correct prayer, and it is not change them.

Steve Alessi:
Right. So the thought then is, and humorously, we can make fun of this. It's easy to do so when it seems to be minute issues that are irritating a person. There's something— what I do that may irritate you is something that's just part of my DNA, right? My personality. It's been who I am all these years, way before you came on the scene. That's who I was. So those little irritants are things that necessarily we can joke about them not changing or trying to change. Then again, there could be some serious weighty things.

Steve Alessi:
Neglect, overspending, addictions, things like that.

Mary Alessi:
Apathy, just disinterested.

Steve Alessi:
Where now all of a sudden it's a lot more serious.

Mary Alessi:
Right.

Steve Alessi:
Not to dismiss the serious aspects of this, but to first start and look at it from what would be just the irritants.

Mary Alessi:
Right.

Steve Alessi:
Okay. I don't think you're going to get somebody to change what irritates you about them.

Mary Alessi:
No, I don't think so either.

Steve Alessi:
And I think you're just barking up the wrong tree. You're trying to push a boulder up a hill. They're set in their ways. I'm set in my ways. You're set in your ways about little things that may irritate you or me, right?

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
It's like, Some women can sit there and I'll tell you what irritates me, not about you, but about my son. Right?

Mary Alessi:
Okay.

Steve Alessi:
When Chris sneezes, oh my God, the whole house. Yeah. Everything. Son, cover your mouth or just get up, walk away, calm down. But so those are irritants.

Mary Alessi:
We love you, son.

Steve Alessi:
And those are things that, quite frankly, after a while, at one point it was so— it would drive me crazy because it'd scare me for one thing, you know, in the middle of nowhere, kaboom, a bomb goes off in the house and I'm in close proximity to it scared the crap out of me, right? But I got that. That, that's an irritant. After a while, it just becomes funny because I'm looking at it like, really? You just blew up the whole house. You woke up the kid that's been up in the room upstairs, for God's sake, you know? And it's on you now. You got to put up with a crying baby. Those are things that I just don't think you're going to change. I don't care what we do. Chris is not going to be a quiet sneezer.

Mary Alessi:
No, he's not going to hold it in.

Steve Alessi:
No. So if that bothered Rachelle, sorry, Rachelle, you're stuck with that. Get earplugs. When he's ready, put on earmuffs or something. Cover your ears because he cannot control his sneeze. So I think there's parts of that that a couple should look at and say, you know, it may irritate me, but if I change the way I look at that.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
It's not really that bad.

Mary Alessi:
It's not that big a deal.

Steve Alessi:
It's just kind of humorous. Yeah, that's just them, right? It's like giving them a nickname. He's the sneezer.

Mary Alessi:
I know. Well, you used to sneeze like that.

Steve Alessi:
I've changed.

Mary Alessi:
I've changed you. No, actually, no, you did. Remember, you would sneeze, but you'd sneeze like 12 times. I used to laugh like, what? Wait, 1, 2, 3. Remember, you would sneeze, but it was— I stopped wearing colognes that would make you allergic.

Steve Alessi:
Thank you very much.

Mary Alessi:
So maybe we need to talk to Chris that that's the problem. But I will say that if we're talking about Chris, let's talk about Rochelle, because we can, right? We've earned this. Sorry, guys. Too bad.

Steve Alessi:
They're living with us right now.

Mary Alessi:
We can say what we want. She's a thinker before she speaks. Chris is a speaker before he thinks, right? He says it and then he hears it and he goes, is that really what I think? He needs more coffee, y'all, stat. My husband needs coffee.

Steve Alessi:
This is going to be maybe a 2-cup.

Mary Alessi:
Pastor Steve needs coffee, stat. Anyhow, I love you.

Steve Alessi:
Go.

Mary Alessi:
Don't change. Be you. So, Rachelle, when you ask her something light, like, hey, what do you want for dinner? She'll go—

Steve Alessi:
I don't think it's just Rachelle. That's women.

Mary Alessi:
No, but Rachelle is extreme. She'll go, Because she was thinking about what she says. And in the thinking, she's processing. I don't want to state what I want. Her heart is always so pure, right? Always so pure.

Steve Alessi:
She's probably thinking, this is what I want, but is that what he wants?

Mary Alessi:
Is that what he wants? Is that what my mother-in-law wants? Because they're living with us right now. Or do we have time to make that? So in her process, it might be 15 seconds, but if you're married to her, it seems like 15 minutes. And Lauren's the same way. They don't process or think about it until you ask them. They're not thinking about that until you ask them. Christopher, the fact that he asked you that question, he's been thinking about it all morning. He's like, answer right now. So it's funny and it's cute when it's, what are we going to eat for dinner? However, if Chris— and we talked about this this week, that when they started dating and then in their engagement period, because she was like that.

Mary Alessi:
He had to learn that about her. He had to learn that she had to think about it. And so I reminded them of the conversation that I had with her right before they got engaged. Actually, I think they were engaged. And so it was the Super Bowl. And so I pulled her over. I said, Rachelle, I just want to talk to you. I want to see how you're feeling, honey.

Mary Alessi:
What are you going through? Do you love Chris with all your heart? Is this the one for you?

Steve Alessi:
And she goes, And you're sitting there watching this.

Mary Alessi:
Oh, my God. She's not into Chris. She goes, I do. I do with all my heart. I love him. And I'm like, oh, my God. Oh, my God. But that's— I'm a fast processor, too.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah.

Mary Alessi:
So you might be thinking, Good. Take your time. Answer correctly. I'm like, you should have already spit that out, sister. You guys are headed to the altar. But that's not what she was thinking. So when it comes to your spouse, what happens with us in marriage is we so desperately need our spouse to get us and give us what we need. And sometimes those expectations are just unfair.

Mary Alessi:
And the goal is to not say, God, change them. It's really more, God, help me understand them.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah, well, that's her personality.

Mary Alessi:
That's her.

Steve Alessi:
And you're not going to change that part of her personality.

Mary Alessi:
That's how her brain works.

Steve Alessi:
That is how her brain works.

Mary Alessi:
Her brain processes like that. And how many times have we said about her, thank God between her and Lauren, we have slow processors in the family. We have family members. Well, look at that. Very good.

Steve Alessi:
All right. Got a bigger cup. There we go.

Mary Alessi:
You happy now?

Steve Alessi:
I am.

Mary Alessi:
We can't go for the last 30 minutes of this podcast. We're glad that she's a slow process.

Steve Alessi:
Yes. So those are irritants that are not a big deal. And I guess what I would encourage on those things there, I just think you need to step back a little bit and look and think, you know what, if this was any different with them, would they be as cute to me in the long run as they were at the beginning? Right. You know, if you just look at it in the sense of that shouldn't be an irritant, that's just who they are. Maybe it helps you, you adjust and adapt better to what you're trying to change in them.

Mary Alessi:
Right.

Steve Alessi:
Maybe you change. Because what I've learned is on irritant things.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
Matters. You're not gonna change somebody.

Mary Alessi:
No.

Steve Alessi:
I say it all the time with, you know, some guys and stuff. Hey, last time You changed. Your mom changed you. The last time a person changed, your mom changed your diaper. That was it. But you're not changing. And, hey, people want to get their life right. They may be dealing with things that could get in the way of their Christianity.

Steve Alessi:
I've seen people, when God starts tugging at their hearts, they don't even change. So if God can't change a person, how do you think a spouse is going to change them?

Mary Alessi:
Right.

Steve Alessi:
So there's certain things you just shouldn't try to change. And you, on your end of it— and maybe this is easier for a woman, but for a guy, you just got to learn to step back a little bit and say, all right, is what I'm expecting of them even realistic?

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
There were things that I wanted from you, right? I wanted this, that, or the other., and it would bother me if I couldn't get that from you. And I would, you know, bring it up and it'd become an argument. I had to go back and learn, wait a minute, is my expectations even real? Right? If they're not, then it's on me as the husband, the spouse here, to manage my expectations if they're unrealistic in the long run. So there's certain parts of a person's personality, their habits. Hey, let me be the person that adjusts with my expectations towards that. Because one thing I don't want to ever do, and I think men got to be careful of this, you put too much pressure on your woman, she's not going to be happy.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah, it's true.

Steve Alessi:
And you can't put pressure. You can't ask her to do something that's going to force her again, little things that just irritate you. Yeah, that's going to force her to have to be so focused on making you happy that she's got to change. She's not gonna make you happy, man.

Mary Alessi:
No, because she's gonna get miserable.

Steve Alessi:
She's gonna feel the pressure. And I don't know too many women that in pressurized moments are just their happy-go-lucky selves.

Mary Alessi:
They don't respond well to it.

Steve Alessi:
I think that's the covering a man provides. Sure. It's on us to provide an environment for our woman where she can be the best version of herself. Yeah. If there's things that you want her to adjust and adapt, you may be able to talk about it. But if she's not convinced that that's something that needs to adjust, don't put the pressure. Yeah. You step back a little bit and say, all right, let me adapt.

Steve Alessi:
Let me adjust. It's not a big deal in the long run. It's not a big deal. It's not. We learn that. You and I, because I was the pressure person and there were things that you wanted me to change. And we'd go back and forth. Like my aggression.

Steve Alessi:
You didn't like that I would want to talk about something in the moment. Then when I'd start talking about it, you thought I was yelling. And I'm like, Mary, I'm not yelling. This is not yelling yet. You'll hear yelling when I'm yelling. But right now, this is just me being forceful. I want to get this point across to you. Right.

Steve Alessi:
That was, oh, my God, he's yelling at me. He's getting aggressive. And so I'd like, no, no, no. And you had to realize that's part of my personality. Right. And we were able to make those adjustments. We saw that, though, when we got around another couple who just would let issues that would come up. It was like water off a duck's back.

Steve Alessi:
They didn't make big deals of it. And that helped us tremendously. It did. Now, so those are the little things that just kind of irritate. But what are the— what about the big things?

Mary Alessi:
Yeah. You know, that's the part about it. When you do go back to dating for a minute, it's important in that dating experience to vet one another because you say this all the time. You've said it to our kids. That part about them will not change. That is who they are. So do not think— and I think women make this mistake— I'll marry you and I'll change you. Now, that'll get better when we get married.

Mary Alessi:
He'll grow up and my influence will change him. And a person is who they are. That doesn't mean there aren't idiosyncrasies or things that might be not of good character, that having a good spouse does refine and define. It helps us be better. I know you've made me better and I've made you better in a lot of ways, but it's taken a lifetime. It's not overnight. 38 years. Taken a long time.

Mary Alessi:
But I think that it's important to go into a relationship eyes wide open with the right expectations. Knowing that it's hard enough to change yourself versus hoping that other person would change. And there are some big issues in marriage.

Steve Alessi:
So what if I was abusive? What if my anger would get out of control and now I'm holding you down, I'm getting physical with you, I'm grabbing you by the hair if I'm mad or something like that. Now, those are big issues that that's probably separation and divorce.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah. When there's physical altercations that aren't under control, especially in today's climate, that is a reason.

Steve Alessi:
What if he or she doesn't stop cheating on you?

Mary Alessi:
I think that's another grounds for divorce. I think that there are things that when they will not change and they are hellbent on sabotaging themselves, because most of the time abuse is not about the spouse. It's about the abuser, the one doing the abuse. They're the one struggling. Immorality, constant cheating. It's about the person who's cheating. It's not about their spouse.

Steve Alessi:
Okay, so I got a gambling addiction.

Mary Alessi:
How do I— I think that's another— when it puts you at risk physically, emotionally, and even financially, I think that the Bible also gives you an out for divorce. Yeah, I think there are things that we should save our prayers for with our spouse. If there is something deeper where they are struggling with pornography and an addiction, but they want to stay in the marriage, or they are struggling with some financial debt and situations, but they want to get it right and their heart is willing to say, I'll fix it, you stay in the marriage. But I think, let's just look at it this way. There's still a lot of young men out there that get married and want to play video games all night long. So should I pray, Lord, change him? So there's deep stuff, there's shallow stuff. There's the fears of if it's video games today, is it gambling addiction tomorrow? The fears of how far does this go? When do I speak up? When do I ask them to stop? It's gone too far. And that's where it does get difficult.

Mary Alessi:
We don't always have the answers in relationships to know exactly what to do and when to do it. When is a spouse to speak up or let's just put it in reverse because we're focusing on maybe a man having all those issues. But what about women? What about when a woman, her hormones are so out of control, she's neglecting the family, she's not taking care of the home, she's not taking care of the kids, she's not fulfilling her duties as a partner in the marriage. What does the man do? Where does he say enough? Or she's so disrespectful and it never seems to occur to her that it's destroying the relationship because she's cruel to her spouse. When is it? Okay, that's too far now. It's too much time has gone on where there aren't any changes.

Steve Alessi:
Well, I have a couple of opinions on those big things. One is I know love must be tough, right? So that was the whole James Dobson book back in the days. And then we had the other group of guys. I can't remember their name right now. They still have an organization today, but it's about boundaries. Okay. McLeod, I think his name was. All of those are huge.

Steve Alessi:
They're hugely important that when you are being abused in any environment or when you have somebody that is violating their marital vows to you, you do have to make sure you put up certain boundaries to show the other person your dignity and your self-respect is not going to be run over. You can't continue to do that. And tell me you love me. So now there's this disconnect. So if you don't— you're not going to love me and take care of me, I got to love myself and take care of me. So there does come a time when you got to draw boundaries. And if separation is something that you got to look into, great. You should really do so with a lot of guidance, with a lot of prayer, a lot of counsel.

Steve Alessi:
Then if it's divorce, ultimately, because the individual is not getting better, that again goes right in line. But I say all of that with this other side. And this is where maybe the 65-year-old Steve steps into the picture and brings a little bit more grace, balance to that hard stand. And that is, could it be seasonal? There are some guys and women that go through something I just, you know, if I can be fully transparent, guys going through porn, dealing with the addiction of porn, why is it a big deal? Some guys think it's not a big deal. In our culture today, it's not a big deal. It's a vice. Well, in my day it was a sin. And if it's a sin, sin separates you not only from God, separates you from the person.

Steve Alessi:
And I think the problem with pornography is it does give a man an image in his mind that he has so that when he does go to his wife, she can't perform at that level. So it creates a separation. All right. So is that in itself adultery? Is that, all right, he's moving away from his spouse? Right. Maybe so. But is it divorce-worthy, separation-worthy if she keeps going to his phone and catching him with this stuff and going to his computer and seeing it? I don't know. Right. And the reason I say that is because here's where the grace comes in.

Steve Alessi:
Because I know hormonally-wise, you want to talk about female women's hormones, testosterone with a man. That in itself will play a role as he gets older. Things are going to change. What was something that was so enticing as a young man will change in the different seasons of his life. So do you end a lifetime covenant commitment with somebody where now if you end it, the kids are going to be affected? Christmases, Thanksgiving, every holiday, weddings, things. Yeah, you're dealing with it. Graduations. Who's going to marry the daughter? Who's going to walk her down the aisle in the future? All those things.

Steve Alessi:
Got to be taken into consideration that if you go ahead and do it because you— this person just won't change, maybe over time and seasons it will. Yeah. And then you're able to look at one another, and maybe this is being naive, you're able to look at one another and say, oh my gosh, we do love each other more today than we did when we started. Because we hung with each other when things were so bad. Yeah. And other people would have left. So there are aspects of it that I guess it goes back to saying, is the change that's needed, if they don't ever change, will it be a deal breaker?

Mary Alessi:
I think that it goes back to the other spouse who is either asking God for more grace to stay in this relationship or sees the value in that person, that this is something that can be overcome. We can overcome this together. And that is something that we are losing in our society today, because the minute someone hurts us in our marriage, in our relationship, we're like, I'm out, I'm starting over. And that's not necessarily the easiest way out, especially if children are involved. Staying in the relationship, fighting through the difficulties. And when we say difficulties, that's what we're talking about. Sometimes it's the hidden sins or vices of our spouse, the things that maybe they did in their singleness, they did in their childhood, and now they brought into the marriage. And you as a spouse are like, how do I— I didn't know that this was a part of you.

Mary Alessi:
I didn't know that you would— that this came with you. And now here it is put on me. Well, I, I think that that's where grace does come in. And prayer does come in for the spouse, where we can pray the right prayer. Lord, speak to their heart and change them and use me in whatever way that I could be used to help my spouse. But sometimes, unless you're in a good environment of a church where you are around good couples that will stick it out and we're honest about our relationships, it's hard for couples to get there. Because the minute they hit that roadblock, it's peace out. I'm starting over.

Mary Alessi:
It's too hard. But we know this. What makes the strongest relationships are when you make a decision that we're going to be in this together, as hard as it is. And maybe other people would think you should leave, you should bail, but we're going to stick it out because both are willing to look at themselves. Both are willing to lay down whatever might be hurting the other one and walk through this together and work it out. And that honors God and it honors the family. And there's such a blessing in that because in the future you can say after 30, 40 years, no, we didn't make it. You're a better person than me because you stayed by my side when you could have left, but you didn't.

Mary Alessi:
You stayed there. There's such a reward in that. That I think it might be harder for the younger generation to fully grasp until you're there. Right. I didn't grasp that.

Steve Alessi:
No. And we had two men in our lives, without getting too personal on this one. One looked in the mirror after having to get beat up by the family and stuff and say, you know what, I'm not going to sacrifice the family. Yeah. And the miracle is there was change in his life. He made the change.

Mary Alessi:
And that's it right there.

Steve Alessi:
And so that was somebody who was one of those black and white situations, do or die. They made the change. There's another individual in life that never did, and he ended up being divorced and lived with this ton of regret, died in misery and despair. And we know the wife in that scenario would even say all these years later, there is a little regret. Not that they had to separate and divorce. The regret is a broken dream. Oh, sure. That it just didn't pan out like it could have.

Steve Alessi:
So can a guy change? Can a girl change? Yes, they can. All right. When it's small things, let it go. Not a big deal. Big things. All right. They can change. Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
But then again, there's some that will not change. And if you're dealing with a will-not-change kind of a person now, now you've got to take that extra step to protect you, protect the family, the home, and so forth. And that's hard.

Mary Alessi:
And it's hard to know when that's the case. Like, am I in a relationship with a person who will not and is refusing to change? I think you don't bail too quick. You stay in it as long as you can. And when it's just year after year after year and you've been open, you've been honest, you've been respectful to share your frustration, gotten help, and there's still no willingness to change, that's when you've really got to consider your options because it's hard. But if we go back to the God change my spouse prayer, The reason that prayer is wrong, it's you're not being heard. God won't change your spouse. God can only change you. And that's the mirror principle that's so important that we every day put a mirror up in front of us and we put our focus on God, change me.

Mary Alessi:
What about me that needs to be changed? I put my focus there. Maybe I'm too strong. Maybe I'm not listening. Maybe I'm not intimately giving my spouse what they need. Maybe I'm not listening, whatever those things are, Lord, change me, whatever my spouse is saying about me, that's driving me crazy. If there's truth in it, then help me to see that about myself and change my heart. If that's our prayer every day, God will, he'll reveal it. And when both spouses are praying that prayer, it's a beautiful marriage.

Mary Alessi:
But there is no perfect friendship. There is no perfect relationship. Siblings fight, friends fight, we get frustrated with each other, and marriages are going to be hard. They just are, but they're worth it in the end. And I think it's not because of what the marriage becomes. I think it's about who we become in the marriage. I'm better because of your influence. I'm better because I prayed that prayer, Lord, change me.

Mary Alessi:
You're better because you prayed that prayer. Lord, change me, and your heart would soften to and be tender to, you know, let, let me give Mary what she needs. Let me give Steve what he needs. Even though in my flesh, I already did. I've given you everything. I don't know how much more. You're asking too much. Your expectations are too high.

Mary Alessi:
All those arguments and all those fights are normal. It's great to be able to say to our kids who are newly married, guys, this is normal. And when you do kind of sift through the what's the normal pile for expectation of marriage? And okay, this is abnormal. And you separate those two things. It makes decision making a lot easier. It helps you know kind of how to approach the day-to-day frustrations or irritations that your spouse is operating in or yourself. And you are aware of the— instead of being so focused on, you sneeze 18,000 times, or the things that you do irritate me. What about me? Is there anything I do that irritates you? Absolutely.

Mary Alessi:
There's plenty of things. There are things that I can get better at and fix so that you're not irritated. Because you know what? That is irritating. You know, I look at that and I go, he's right. That's irritating. I wouldn't like that. Let me fix that. I didn't even see that.

Mary Alessi:
I had blind spots. And when you both come to the table that way, And then you also understand a third of this, we're going to fight. It's okay. You separate the two extremes from real problems to this is normal. You get through marriage. And if you deal with an extreme relationship, you still come out on top because you weathered the storms and you stayed together.

Steve Alessi:
Adam and Eve, perfect beings that were crafted by God himself.

Mary Alessi:
Oh my goodness.

Steve Alessi:
Had their issues. Yep. She went ahead and made a decision that had eternal consequences. That's right. And, um, couldn't change her. No. She evidently had this desire to want to get ahead and maybe not as patient as she should have been and lean in more to her husband's, uh, desires and wishes and leadership. But no, she had to go ahead and Reach out, grab it.

Steve Alessi:
I mean, imagine the conflict those two had. Yeah, it had to be conflict, Mary, because their sons, Cain and Abel, one of them ended up killing the other. I know. So we heard that bit about that one comedian. Oh my gosh, talking about you think it's bad on the world, on the planet today. Come on, you had one guy kill a quarter.

Mary Alessi:
No, half of the population.

Steve Alessi:
No, a quarter of the population. Took out his brother. So there had to be conflict there to create something in those two young men that then created that response. Taking his brother's life? Are you kidding me? Yeah. So from day one, there would have been conflict on the earth between men and women. And I just don't know if it's realistic for you to be thinking, I got to change them. No. When I was in college, I would see these young girls over there because we'd go to the laundromat.

Steve Alessi:
And I was always— you know what, I always was going to wash my own clothes because I just wanted to wash them the way I wanted to wash them.

Mary Alessi:
You're still like that.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah. So I'd be over there doing my laundry, and I'd see my buddy's girlfriend's over there with 2 loads of laundry, theirs and my buddy's, their now boyfriend. And I'd be thinking to myself, wow. That's going to get old. Yeah, real quick. That's gonna get old. You think, oh, you're taking care of your baby, you know, so you're taking care of them. And then you go ahead and let that happen.

Steve Alessi:
Then they start getting married. Now you're mad at him for having to wash his laundry. Yeah, you started it.

Mary Alessi:
Come on. But I think that, I think that what a key component in marriage that makes it work, but also brings conflict down is to take personal responsibility for yourself. Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
That's huge. And so let's, let's end with those kind of comments there, because the environment that we have chose to live our lives and raise our kids is the church community environment. So our metro, we started it 38, 28 years ago. So this is where we're at. Our friends are here, our people, brothers to me. I don't have brothers. I got two sisters, brothers to me. Are here in this house.

Steve Alessi:
That's right. Guys that, that just— I get to— I really enjoy spending time with. Right. And we've all been through seasons of our lives where we've needed each other to help us through hard times. Right. So whether it was helping them change, helping me change, helping me get back on my feet after I've fallen, that community in the house has helped us stay married, Okay, absolutely. Helped us keep our stuff together when we could have lost it. Helped us after we've fallen get back up on our feet and say, no, we're going forward.

Steve Alessi:
And the beautiful thing is we have all these years later that we still look at each other, seem to have a respect for each other, enjoy hanging out with each other in spite of our imperfections. Because I know there's things I do that irritate them, and there's Definitely things they do that irritate me, but we're still buds. Yeah, right. So this environment, this church community, if you want somebody to change, your marriage isn't what it should be, you want it to be, be in this environment. Be willing to put yourself around other people that are going to make you feel uncomfortable about yourself, but maybe they're going to help you change. Because the thing that you're struggling with may be the thing your spouse is struggling with.

Mary Alessi:
Yeah.

Steve Alessi:
So that's such a healthy environment to be around other people.

Mary Alessi:
Oh my goodness.

Steve Alessi:
Don't just isolate yourself. You're never going to change.

Mary Alessi:
I think we tell young couples that are newly married this all the time. Get around another couple that's been married 10+ years. Hang out with them more than you're hanging out with couples that are married around the same time as you. Get around couples intentionally that have been married longer and aren't taking each other as seriously. You will avoid so much conflict. You will save so much time. You'll see your spouse much quicker in a light with a lot more grace and less wanting them to change because you take the pressure off and you realize, wow, my husband's this way. It drives me crazy.

Mary Alessi:
I get around this other couple, her husband's the same way. Wait, are all men like this? Yes, they are. They're all this way. Same with women. Are all women— that's exactly the kind of stuff my wife does that drives me crazy. But wow, his wife does it and he laughs and giggles and thinks it's cute. And they probably had sex tonight and we didn't. And it lightens up the extreme pressure that you put on one another when you get around other couples who've really gotten through some of that stuff already that happens in the first 5 years of marriage.

Mary Alessi:
Because the most beautiful thing, and we're watching it with our kids being married, is those stages of understanding. The stage of I can't— I love you, I want to marry you to I can't stand you, get out of my face. Why did I marry you? And we tell our kids that stage is— you are going to look at each other and say, what have I done? And when they're dating, they don't believe us. Then they get married and they go, Mom and Dad, you were right. But if you stick it out and you do smart things, die to yourself, not be so focused on the other person. Just be focused on the things that you could do better to bring the conflict down. Yeah. Focus on those things.

Mary Alessi:
You can do it. I could do it. If the sink being full of dishes bothered you to clean them tonight, or let's be honest, the dry ones, put them away. Not dirty dishes. You didn't even like dishes being out on the sink. And I wanted to do it the next morning, but you're like, no, let's do it tonight. And that was conflict. I just learned.

Mary Alessi:
Avoid conflict. Let me just put them away tonight. Now I'm addicted. I can't handle having dishes out on the sink as much anymore. So I've gotten better. You've gotten better. You've lightened up. But it didn't just take you and me.

Mary Alessi:
It was the exposure to some amazing couples that were around us and some couples that we would get around and go, I love you. I'm so glad you're my husband.

Steve Alessi:
All right. I haven't heard a word you said since you used the term makeup sex.

Mary Alessi:
I didn't say makeup sex.

Steve Alessi:
You said makeup sex.

Mary Alessi:
I did not say makeup sex. I said, and they had sex and we didn't.

Steve Alessi:
No, you said makeup sex.

Mary Alessi:
I did not say makeup sex.

Steve Alessi:
Yeah, you did. So I'm just—

Mary Alessi:
Did I say makeup sex? Yes. I did not say it. They're telling you I did not say it.

Steve Alessi:
She said makeup sex. So wait a minute. You said sex. That's as far as it has to go. What is wrong with you? So I have no idea. Like I said, I haven't heard another thing you have said since you said sex. But since you're on the subject of sex and makeup sex—

Mary Alessi:
I didn't say makeup sex.

Steve Alessi:
I'm saying— makeup sex.

Mary Alessi:
Why? It doesn't fit this conversation.

Steve Alessi:
Yes, it does, because we're about to have a fight. If you do have a fight because of things that the other person won't change, once you make up about that fight, there's such thing as something called makeup sex. Okay. And that's a beautiful thing.

Mary Alessi:
Yes, it is. So you're saying fight more?

Steve Alessi:
I'm saying it is not all. Yeah, there you go.

Mary Alessi:
I knew you loved conflict. You've always loved conflict.

Steve Alessi:
And why is makeup sex so?

Mary Alessi:
Because usually the wife's like, don't you even.

Steve Alessi:
No, I don't think so. I think when you really do smoke the peace pipe, if that's how we can conclude this.

Mary Alessi:
It's true.

Steve Alessi:
It's when your vulnerabilities, you've opened yourself up, you've been honest. When you say I'm sorry and you both kind of hammer it out and you walk it through and you're like, that was so hard, man. Yeah. When that is the case, that seems to be the time when all your defenses are down. Very true. And almost when you're intimately the closest to one another.

Mary Alessi:
It's very true.

Steve Alessi:
Because now you're just grateful. Yeah. We love each other. We got through another hard time, a fight, a battle. And that's why makeup sex is so beautiful. It's true. So maybe you don't want to change everything because a little friction, spice, little conflict, it does keep it hot. Hey, right, the right environments.

Mary Alessi:
Ashley's dying right now. Oh my gosh, Ashley, you should see her. Poor thing. All right, still single. She's gonna stay single forever. We have completely distorted her and destroyed her. We're so sorry, Ashley.

Steve Alessi:
All right, thank you for joining us again on another episode of The Family Business with the Alessis. Hopefully you learned something today. Keep fighting and keep— don't say making up.

Mary Alessi:
Take care. Thanks so much for joining The Family Business today. If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to follow or subscribe, share it with a friend, and leave us a review. We appreciate your support and can't wait to have you join us next time, because family is everybody's business.